Methamphetamine Positive Lands Gorder 14-Month Suspension

by | 04.22.2015 | 8:11am
Trainer Kellyn Gorder

Trainer Kellyn Gorder has been suspended one year and fined $5,000 by Kentucky Horse Racing Commission stewards after the discovery of methamphetamine in Bourbon Warfare, a 3-year-old Colonel John filly owned by Bourbon Lane Stable who finished first in a maiden special weight race at Churchill Downs Nov. 22, 2014.

Gorder was suspended an additional 60 days when a barn search at Keeneland on Dec. 27, the day Gorder was notified of the methamphetamine positive, turned up injectable medications, syringes, needles and oral medications not properly labeled.

Gorder is appealing the suspension and is represented by Lexington attorney Mike Meuser.

The drug, classified by the Association of Racing Commissioners International as Class 1, was detected in a blood sample by LGC Science in Lexington and a split sample confirmed by the Maddy Laboratory at the University of California-Davis.

Methamphetamine is a term used to describe a widely abused stimulant street drug, but it is also sold under the brand name Desoxyn to treat obsesity and attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) in humans.

Gorder believes contamination caused the positive test.

“There's no reason it should be there,” Gorder told the Paulick Report. “And there's no reason anyone would give that to a horse.”

Gorder said he had 33 of his employees given drug tests but there were “no positives…nothing.”

The “injectable” found during the barn search, according to Gorder, was Naxcel, an antibiotic being used on a horse that had been treated with a nebulizer.

Gorder, a 47-year-old Minnesota native, is a former jockey who previously worked under Jack Van Berg. He was first licensed as a trainer in 2001 and was coming off his two best years in 2013 (55 wins from 306 starts for $2.3 million in earnings) and 2014 (67 wins from 352 starts, $2.2 million). His only previous medication violation occurred with a clenbuterol positive at Ellis Park in 2013 when he was suspended 20 days.

“It's serious, serious shit,” he said. “Fourteen months. You're talking about starting over. The clenbuterol was a wake-up call for me and I really tried to tighten the operation, then this happens. It's very disheartening.”

Bourbon Warfare, who most recently won an Oaklawn Park allowance race on April 2, was disqualified from her Nov. 22 win at Churchill Downs with all monies redistributed.

  • Evelyn Waugh

    Broken–& still, bad.

    Book ‘im, Danno.

    • I didn’t realize they had snark in your era Evelyn.

  • Peyton

    Contaminated again. Those darn meth seeds in our bagels.

    • snowy19

      Yes, the horses blood was contaminated with the methamphetamine that Gorder had injected into the horse. Simple enough. Should take at least 3-3/12 years to do a thorough investigation by ‘officials’ who work around the clock on these matters. I’ve been told by Brian Williams that these ‘officials’ work tirelessly, around the clock including holidays and Sundays to resolve these appeals in a timely manner.

      • Lynn

        Methamphetamine contamination is wide spread: Methamphetamines are a Clear Danger to the Environment. Illicit methamphetamine dumping has killed livestock. A group of forestry workers were taken ill when they came in contact with a meth dump. A meth lab that had been operating for several years produced so many toxic fumes that the surrounding trees, 150-year-old Ponderosa pines, had died. Tree kills around meth labs are not rare occurrences. In fact,26,000 acres of Tahoma State Forest were Closed because of meth pollution.

        The “injectable” found during the barn search, according to Gorder, was Naxcel, an antibiotic being used on a horse that had been treated with a nebulizer. An Antibiotic Biotic is also treated as a great crime by the regulators???

        • Ben van den Brink

          turned up injectable medications, syringes, needles and oral medications not properly labeled.

          Without proper labelling, one can not check, somebodies book keeping and not the vet. So keep records, straight all the time.

        • AngelaFromAbilene

          Unfortunately Lynn, most folks do not understand or believe just how easily contamination can occur, as evidenced by the idiotic comments they make. I don’t know the guy but with his record and Barry Irwin standing by him, I’ll withhold judgement.

        • snowy19

          If methamphetamine contamination is widespread, horses would be continuously be testing positive. That is not at all the case. Stewards say ‘ Gorders stable was in violation of rules prohibiting a person other than a veterinarian from possessing injectable medications, hypodermic syringes, or a needle.’ Gorder says ‘I keep syringes in my barn to give oral medications and eye medications’. He is admitting he has broken rules that are being enforced by the stewards. If you have an issue with the stewards actions or the rules prohibiting a barn from possessing these banned items, you haven’t stated it. Therefore this is a clear case of rules being broken and penalties being enforced. No more lame excuses necessary.

    • I had to go to six different stores before I found lox uncontaminated by the meth seeds, the heroin & cauliflower dip, the meth milkshakes (vanilla, chocolate and Gumi Bears), etc. Wore me out.

      • Peyton

        How were those speedball Gumi’s?

  • Concerned Observer

    Sorry to hear it. He is a talented horseman.

    33 employees. How does a trainer get his arms around an operation that big? With drug testing getting tougher and tougher, perhaps some trainers will begin to understand that the size of their stable is a major liability, and that it is bordering on impossible to control that many people. Without very very close scrutiny, each employee has the potential to destroy the reputation and livelihood of the trainer.

    • Needles

      A talented horseman doesn’t cheat. Period.

    • Larry Ensor

      I’d like to know where he found 33 with enough basic knowledge of horses that are worth hiring. I have a hard time finding a couple.

      • Location location location

        • Larry Ensor

          Barry, My farm is not exactly in the middle no where. 20 minutes from Fair Hill, around the block from Sheppard’s, 15 minutes from New Bolton, across the street from Iron Springs Farm one of the biggest Sport Horse breeding farm in the county. You can’t swing a cat and not hit a horse around here, TBs,flat and Steeplechase Eventer, H/J, Fox hunters you name it. Are there people to be had sure, “knowledgeable horse people” that all depends on someones standards and expectations.

          • Evelyn Waugh

            Yes, Mr. Ensor, I read with rapt attention your account with the mare you rescued from New Holland, by way of AC4H. I doff my hat to you & yours for taking responsibility & action (on behalf of Double & I trust other horses too). Going to New Holland (as I have been in the company of Maryland rescue groups) may well be one of the most demoralizing experiences possible. I too rescued a Pennsylvania-bred TB (whose grand sire was trained by your neighbor, Mr. Sheppard) who early into his 3rd year of life in of training in the barn of a low-level (think Charlestown) trainer was deemed more worthy of auction at New Holland…than other life possibilities. His Pennsylvania breeder/owner ordered the trainer to “get rid of him” & instead of trailering him over to New Holland, the kindly trainer contacted a Maryland horse rescue organization. I adopted him in 2006 & in February he turned 14 years…& will soon take up his new residence in beautiful Carroll County, MD in what I sincerely hope will be his…forever home (& I will unfortunately only be able to visit/be with him on the weekends. Our riding days are over & I want him to enjoy his life as a horse…among other horses. All the best to you & yours.

          • AngelaFromAbilene

            Larry, I actually know several knowledgeable, competent, experienced hands in your neck of the woods. If you are looking for help, I’d be happy to point them in your direction.

      • secondlife

        Maybe if racetrackers could get at least one day a week off like they do at farms, instead of having to work 7 days a week all year with no break or vacation ever, they might have an easier time finding better quality employees who would be willing to do the work.

    • secondlife

      It may not have been the fault of any of his employees. Unless every racetrack barn had either security cameras or a security guard/night watchman around 24/7 (which most of them don’t), anything could happen.

  • Needles

    And it took a year to adjudicate. This is why horse racing is the worst sport in North America. This is the type of trainer that needs shunned by the sport and his peers. Good riddance.

    • Concerned Observer

      A year? On my calendar, November 2014 to April 2015 is 6 months….almost to the day.

  • Figless

    Can someone explain the benefit of giving Desoxyn to a horse?

    • Tinky

      There were trainers using Ritalin years ago, and the effects – whatever they may be on horses – seem to be very similar with Desoxyn.

      Obviously in general terms it’ a stimulant, and as such a PED for athletes.

  • Bert

    6 months later we hear about this?

    • In racing, this is speed-of-light reporting.

  • Adrian Monk

    I am waiting for comment(s) from Barry Irwin of Team Valor.
    This person trains horse(s) for Team Valor International.
    Barry Irwin is an outspoken proponent of WHOA and has been highly critical of other trainers who are suspended for drug infractions.
    Should be interesting to see what he does with the horse(s) in this trainers care.

    • Thanks for availing me of the opportunity to comment on this Mr. Monk.

      I have one horse with Kellyn Gorder and it is not going anywhere.

      I have complete faith that Kellyn is an honest and competent horseman who is not a cheater in any way, shape or form.

      Look for him to be exonerated of the meth charge, which is an obvious case of contamination based on my understanding after discussing the matter with a leader in the field of drug testing.

      As for the Lasix on the syringe, this is puzzling to say the least and I for one will want to know more about this situation.

      FYI, for me to classify a trainer as a cheater, I have to be convinced that there was intent to cheat. This is not the case with Kellyn.

      I find it nothing if not ironic that in an era when known drug cheats are honored and lauded in the media and elsewhere that a guy like Kellyn is about to be dragged through the muck.

      • Ben Colebrook

        I completely agree with Mr Irwin, anyone who knows Kellyn or has seen his operation would know this came from an outside source. As a fellow trainer it’s impossible to completely isolate your horses from the outside world.

      • Adrian Monk

        Very interesting…
        You fire Ralph Nicks and you keep Kellyn Gorder.
        You fire Ralph Nicks and you keep Todd Pletcher.

        • Adrian Monk

          I realize Ralph Nicks is back with you at present, but at the time of the positive you fired him.

          • Ralph Nicks had a horse injected on race day, which was a clear violation of the rules and showed obvious intent. He made a mistake. He paid a price and now is back with us and we are happy to have him.

            What has Pletcher done, besides have the filly Wait a While test positive for the after effects of procaine penicillin?

            Thanks for taking the time to follow my career.

          • Due Process

            Interesting that some people will hold themselves to a lower standard than they are willing to impose on others. Hypocrisy.

          • Yes, you nailed it. I am a complete phonus balonus and you found me out. Congratulations. I admit it and I am not even asking for the due process that is due to me. BTW, if I want to call you and look up your name in the phone book, are you listed under Due or Process? What is your actual last name?

          • Due Process

            My last name is Truthteller. Perhaps you’re learning the lesson that people who throw stones should first take a look around and see if they’re living in a glass house.

            The Kentucky State Police raided your trainer’s barn, which led to this suspension. May the evidence they collected lead to further actions? In any event, this puts the lie the claim that only a Federal takeover of racing can lead to strong action against rule breakers.

          • Where have you read that “only” a Federal takeover of racing can lead to strong action against rule breakers? Who said this? Who said “only?”

          • LongTimeEconomist

            Barry, wasn’t this something Arthur Hancock said about five or ten years ago?

          • I don’t think anybody ever precluded some individual states from being able to handle their business. Indiana is certainly proof of a state that has been very effective. Federal assistance is being sought by WHOA because we believe that by naming USADA to oversee the drug aspsect of the sport, it will give the game its best chance to conduct it on a level playing field. That is what we want. This is not rocket science.

          • Hey, the real Adrian Monk just called and he wants his name back, so you are going to have to dream up a new one, unless of course you grow a pair and use the actual name your parents gave you.

          • Adrian Monk

            I am surprised you have so much time to follow all of the blog postings, with the four horses (Savoy Stomp, To the Victor, Indianaughty, & Unrivaled) Team Valor International syndicated for this year’s Triple Crown for approximately $3 million, getting ready for the Kentucky Derby.
            Oh that’s right, none of them qualified for the Kentucky Derby.
            But I have to give you credit on Unrivaled though; syndicating a $30,000 claimer for $750,000.
            Is your real name Barry Irwin?

          • Hamish

            Didn’t that horse Unrivaled just run in the Bluegrass?

          • Adrian Monk

            I wouldn’t call that running.
            chart: 8 – 8 – 8 – 8 – 8 – 7…never a threat…beaten 13 1/2 lengths.

          • Thanks for revealing your true motives in attacking me. It helps put your pathetic position into perspective.

      • Greg J.

        Agree 100%. Mr. Gorder is a honest horseman and these charges will be proven false.

  • Baddabibg

    This article really does say a lot about the state of the
    sport

    First problem:
    The time it takes before a full investigation is completed and punishment is
    handed down.
    Too many times you read about fines and suspensions being handed down 1-1 ½ years after the violation date.
    Take samples > comes back positive > re-test > comes back positive again > fine and suspend.
    As the trainer in charge of the horses care, you should be held responsible for anything in it’s system.

    Second problem:
    Every trainer that has a suspension levied against them, appeals it (this is
    American and they have that right, which I fully support). Problem is in most
    cases there is no new evidence to be viewed. They just use it as a tool to
    continue training until the suspension is upheld at the appeal.

    There should be a stipulation that if you are found guilty (suspended and
    fined) and you appeal and the original finds are upheld the suspension time is
    going to be doubled

    Third problem:
    One poster called him “a talented horseman”
    This is one of the huge problems with this sport.
    Yes there the trainers that fully know they are cheating, but there are also
    the ones that think they are doing nothing wrong, these drugs have become such
    common place that there are many trainers that just think of it as a daily routine.

    The standard for a “good horseman” is now who can come up with the best mix of
    meds not who has the best training regimen.

    Sad part is the owners know it and because it’s such common place, they don’t
    think about.

    • Concerned Observer

      I stand by my statement. Kellyn is a very talented horseman. I have trained in the same barn with him. He has grown his stable size very quickly, and that can cause administrative and supervision challenges.

      The drug culture mentality you mention is a very serious issue. Even the best horsemen fear (or deep down believe) that their competitors are pushing the limit on drugs. Therefore they rationalize the belief that they too must push the limit just to be competitive. Lasix is a good example. Most lasix is administered not to stop bleeding, but just to stay even with the competitors.

      In my opinion, the only way to break the cycle and change the entrenched mentality of trainers is to make the pain and punishment of drug violation detection so severe that it is worse than the pain of losing races.

      • secondlife

        If most people knew how lax the security can be at a lot of barns, they wouldn’t be surprised that a horse could be contaminated probably from a human. Many backstretch workers aren’t exactly salt of the earth types. Unless a trainer has their own security cameras (some do, some don’t) I can believe just about anything could happen, especially at a racetrack with people coming & going all day.

      • Biggar

        You don’t think a 14 month suspension is that severe?

        • Baddabing

          14 months would mean that he would have to start over when he gets back.
          however in this business (don’t know this guy or his operation) doesn’t necessarily mean that he stops training.
          there are many that are suspended and still run the operation, just a different person on the program.

      • Keyne

        CO:I have horses in the Mid-Atlantic.In my opinion,the number 1 reason for Lasix use is TO MASK AMPHETAMINE USE!!!!!

      • Baddabing

        I agree with you, I know several trainers that train their own horses and treat them like a family pet, but it’s costly and these horses have to at least cover part or the bills.
        In order to keep up with the other guys and tray in business they try to use the same stuff on their horses but they still love their horses.
        it’s just that it has become such common place it’s now barely an after thought and you do often enough now it’s just a routine.

  • Elliott ness

    If competent labs with adequate funding were in station, half of the trainers in this USA would be out for a year. Needles, syringes, the guy obviously knows the rules. Epogen positives will be next for a few targeted big players. With the intense public scrutiny of equine welfare, changes and charges will undoubtedly unfold. Stop walking the tight rope with the rules. Horse first, money second.

  • Larry Ensor

    I don’t know him but I am will to give the guy the benefit of doubt based on having only one infraction in 14 years. And it sounds like he has a barn full of horses. So IMO if he was a “cheater” the rule of averages would suggest he would have had a number of violations.

    I’ll play devil’s advocate;

    Meth does not need to be injected. Blow some up a horses nose is all that is needed. Absorbed quickly not much different the coke.

    “Backside” workers love to cash tickets. Always on the look out for “inside information”. “closely held” inside information even better. The horse finished 5th beaten 15 lengths in her first stats at around 5-1. A month later she runs back at the same distance at a different track and wins by 2 1/2 at around 6-1. Not a huge payoff and not usual. But a nice payoff for someone in the “know”. Just another way of looking at. Having spent a few years on the backside I saw all kinds of crazy things. Not hard to imagine considering they average backside worker makes a “living wage” at best.

    No smart “cheater” trainer would use Meth as a means to win a race let alone cash a ticket on a 6-1 and not expect to get caught. Smart “cheaters” know how to find stuff that is not being “tested” for.

    Where as someone who has easy access to a horse could care less if the horse/trainer gets caught. They have already cashed their tickets. This is “insider cheating” 101.

    Unfortunately the trainer is ultimately responsible. Just saying there are others ways of looking at it.

    Maybe a lie detector test is in order.

    • naprovniknaprovnik

      maybe it is time to enter the 21st century and install cameras

    • BILL CASNER

      I have known Kelly Gorder for 17 years and I promise you there is not a straighter arrow on the race track. He worked for us at WinStar and he has trained horses for me.
      Meth, as you stated, is a street drug and no trainer would be stupid enough to use it. It is detected with an elementary test and this particular positive was 20 pico-grams which translates to 20/10,000,000,000,000 or 20 ten trillions’ of a gram. This is obviously a residue from a trace contamination weeks prior and could in no way have effected performance. There is no stronger advocate for punishing cheaters than myself but in this is a case of serious injustice without any basic common sense to a very good person. Kellyn is the consummate HORSEMAN who has worked hard to build his reputation. With one fail swoop they have given him a career death sentence.

      • Concerned Observer

        Thanks for adding some common sense to this discussion. Every trainer has a right to be paranoid about the potential for contamination, by accident, a disgruntled employee, or carelessness.

        I know one trainer that got a suspension for an anti-itch medication, the one you put on a bee sting, and is commonly sold over the counter in every drugstore. Think about all the ways that could happen?

        • AngelaFromAbilene

          Every trainer needs to be obsessively paranoid about contamination and still that’s not a guarantee. There are more ways for contamination to occur than you can shake a stick at. I do not have a large stable but you wouldn’t believe the lengths I go to.

          I once had an endurance horse boarded in my barn that had a hot for caffeine. Turns out, the horse had a liking for flat Coca Cola and I had a groom that was forever leaving cans sitting around and sharing with the horse. I no longer allow any beverage in the barn but tap water from the hose in the aisle. Ridiculously anal? Not in my book.

      • John G. Veitch

        This seems to be the case Bill. Of the horses we’ve had with him, he always takes his time, and runs the horse when the horse is ready.

      • AngelaFromAbilene

        I believe you. With this amount, contamination could be so easy. There are literally thousands of ways this horse could have come in contact with methamphetamine. I hope those of you that know him are willing to go to the mat for him. I believe in the “ultimate insurer” rule but I’d hate to see him lose his career due to circumstances beyond his control.

      • David Worley

        Pardon my ignorance on this subject, but even if meth couldn’t be detected I don’t understand why it would be a performance enhancer for a horse. My point here is why is it illegal and punishable? What am I missing? Is it just that it is a stimulant?

      • Keyne

        “Meth ,as you stated,is a street drug and nobody would be stupid enough to use it”..LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
        I have no idea what transpired in the Gorder case,but Lasix(especially here in the mid-atlantic) is used commonly to mask meth use such as mda and crystallized.You need to get back on the turnip truck you fell off of in happytown,and join the real world.

    • Hamish

      A very useful and pertinent explanation of what happens when cashing a ticket becomes the only objective.

    • betterthannothing

      Surveillance cameras trained on all horses 24/7!

      • AngelaFromAbilene

        I have cameras all over this place. As cheap as they are, I don’t understand why everyone doesn’t have them.

        • 5times5

          Can’t imagine running a barn without cameras now days.

    • Ben van den Brink

      Fortunate the trainer is responsible, otherwise the mess would be much and much bigger.

    • Guest

      Call me dumb but how would a barn worker know the dose of meth to give a horse that would improve performance but not harm the horse? Too much and the horse is nuts, just right and the horse improves…not enough and it did not help. And that barn worker, who does not make a whole lot of money anyway, is going to bet on the horse NOT knowing if the horse was given the right amount?

      • Danny Gonzalez

        In the case of cheating or doping a horse with out the trainers knowledge you dont care about how much you give them. In this case any amount present in the horse would be a violation. I am sorry to have to say this but this is going to start being a bigger problem in racing. I had brought this matter to the attention of racing officials several times. Trainers are being targeted its sad that this person has to deal with someone like this. I know of 8 cases where this happened the last one being chris grove in west virginia. The racing regulators need to understand that racing needs to be more protected than in the past. Some backstrectch workers are smarter than you think and many do know how to do things. Cashing a ticket is the most prevalent reason

    • McGov

      I think you nailed it.

  • Michael Rosencrants

    Never guilty, never any ideas on how it got in the horse or why. Poor thing will appeal and appeal until the end of time. Meanwhile the owners and trainers who ran against this horse lost time, day money a race, etc that they can never get back. What about the bettors who didn’t realize that they were betting against a horse that was cheating? Who do they appeal to? Once again the racing public gets screwed. It’s ok though, some nefarious individuals slipped in and gave this animal an illegal substance because they are out to get Mr. Gorder. That makes sense, I feel better already.

    • Elliott ness

      Absolutely

      • Fratman

        Some questions……
        If it’s not important why publicize it or the suspension ??

        33 employees — who did it ?? Badges, security and cameras on the back side ?? Do we ever find out who did it ???? That seems important doesn’t it ??

        Somewhere somehow someone is going to realize people like me bet on these races and find out later that we are fools because they laid another one over on us and eventually bettors will give up and go to something else — true ?? Many of my friends who use to bet horses no longer do.

        So if you have an exotic alive or go 3 for 4 and this was the race you lost that’s not important ??

        I find that trainers may be the most selfish human beings on the face of the earth because it’s always about them and never about the integrity of the sport.

        Credit to Mr. Irwin and others for standing up but we bettors are having more difficulty swallowing all this crap day after day and scandal after scandal and we realize in the pyramid of respect for one another horse players are at the end of the line and leaving slowly but surely.

        I watch trainers and Gorder seems almost too good but hey there are trainers that emerge who are that good and he’s been on his own for how long ?? How many problems so far ??

        Many times these suspensions seem like a warning shot to the trainer who seems to good — hey, we know you’re doing stuff so back off and play within the unwritten rules that all tracks seemingly have.

        It seems obvious that certain jurisdictions let horses run on some medications and others don’t because of the quality of the horses but this muddies the waters even more making it more difficult to come up with solid solutions.

        In California (I’m a small percentage owner on occasion) it seems that the new rules have changed the game — old hard boot trainers can win again, no 20 length winners off the claim and many of the “hot trainers” are no longer hot so we are making head way — hope it works !!

    • betterthannothing

      When will cameras be installed inside all barns and vans and all substances tightly controlled to help protect all horses and innocent people? Cameras are everywhere in the real world and have been so very helpful to prevent crime and catch bad guys fast! Horse racing should have been the very first industry to install security cameras everywhere horses are! Is it waiting to be hit really hard to wise up like the real world has?

  • David

    Two thoughts: (1) I find it really interesting that so many people are gleeful at the career demise of someone else. Gorder and everyone who works for him are functionally losing their livelihood over this situation and that (I think) deserves some tactful respect. If he’s guilty then he needs to serve his time, but even then I think the malice shown by some people on this conversation strand is unwarranted.

    (2) The horse tested positive in a $41K MSW at Churchill; is this one year suspension the right sentence? I’m not implying that it is necessarily too harsh, but I am wondering how this compares with other suspensions that people have received in Kentucky. Thoughts?

    • naprovniknaprovnik

      David, the comment section shenanigans aside, I think suspensions are too lenient and are part of the problem in racing. I would be happy to see cheaters be banned for life. Of course, do impose such harsh circumstances would mean more expensive and thorough testing, but I think in the long run, it would pay back by increasing the popularity of a dying sport. The public is weary of being hoodwinked over and over and over again, not to mention the cruelty of imposing nasty substances on helpless animals. The Japanese Racing Association is quite successful. We should consider that a healthy example to our sick and miserable “system” of 38 little kangaroo courts.

      • David

        Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I don’t disagree as long as the testing and judiciary elements are run in top-notch fashion.

    • David, I for one laud the Kentucky Racing Commission for taking a tough stance on a Class 1 violation. But in an effort to show how serious they are about cleaning up racing, it is unfortunate that they picked on the wrong situation and the wrong guy. Insiders share this opinion. Look for it to be addressed in a more thoughtful manner.

      • David

        Thanks Barry. I have always appreciated your consistent and thoughtful analysis of the industry’s drug issues.

      • Peyton

        You are coming across as a little like God or at least Abraham. “They picked on the wrong situation and the wrong guy?” They did their job and your response is they didn’t do it to your satisfaction because you are Gorder’s character witness. Shut up.

        • AngelaFromAbilene

          Gorder appears to have some mighty fine character witnesses.

    • Keyne

      Is it unnecessarily harsh?? Have you been to an otb lately?The average age of patronage is about 73.7 years of age( not many new fans).If drugs and cheating aren’t aggressively rooted out,our game is dead. If it wasn’t for “slots socialism” most racing would already be dead.
      I feel bad for barn help that are innocent,but how many cheating barns have had their stable employees cash big tickets on drugged horses that cheated the betting public?Maybe it doesn’t happen all the time,but I’d bet it happens from time to time.
      In our game unfortunately,perception is reality…….

    • Needles

      Where do you see glee? I think people are tired of the sport getting dragged through the mud with bad headlines. If he can’t handle a big barn, he needs to downsize to a group he can manage and oversee properly without relying on foreman and grooms to train his horses.

  • Gate To Wire

    Move along. Nothing to see here. Just some contamination. Appeal, Appeal, Appeal.
    Racing is never going to really get serious about drug use. Still clinging to testing and a system that cycling proved was not effective at stopping cheating. Just another day with everyone’s head stuck in the sand.

  • Michael Rosencrants

    Mr. Irwin, thank you for your comments and I respect your success as well as your standing by your trainer. I hope that Mr. Border is exonerated but surely you realize that we hear the same story every time and have (as owners, bettors and enthusiasts) gotten jaded. I run several businesses, I am unable to be present everywhere and if something illegal happens I am forced to pay the consequences. I accept that and try to make sure nothing happens. But I am responsible. Why is horse racing different? How the problems happen has no relevance to my board or the authorities in my businesses why in racing is it a continual free pass? Why is every case “an exception”?

    • I guess one just has to use their best judgment in order to figure out which comments hold water and which don’t. You are right, all the excuses sound the same, but some are valid and some are not. But I do you know one would be hard pressed to find anybody in racing that would consider Kellyn Gorder to be a cheater. Compare that with some other trainers and their supporters.

      • Michael Rosencrants

        So if they have support from the community and a good record we should take it on faith that they are honest. I am not sure I can support that premise any more. I had faith in Roger Clemens, lance Armstrong, Bill Cosby, etc. I believe now that the rules should apply to everyone when the amount of money is at stake that is present here. These incidents and the exceptions have eroded the faith of the buying public to a point that may not be repaired. I hope that he is not guilty but at some point the rules need to be enforced, regardless of who it is or this will be a sport of only owners and trainers.

        • Peyton

          You are completely on the money with your response.

  • Ring of Truth

    You know what’s REALLY weird? This ‘contamination’ stuff seems to happen A LOT in this country but doesn’t seem to happen as much in HK, Oz, Japan, etc. And you know what else is really strange? None of these trainers that get busted are ever guilty.

    I don’t know how are backstretches continue to be contaminated by bad people dumping illict drugs around the horses or why it is in the U.S. grooms. etc. inject horses without trainer knowledge. That’s really bad. Someone should look into why it happens here and not other racing jurisdictions!

    • And how do you know that traces are not found in other racing jurisdictions?

  • Jack Frazier

    It is wise to give a person the benefit of the doubt in situations like this however, there repeat offenders who suffer no consequence. And other than Rick Dutrow, no high profile Thoroughbred trainers have been suspended for ten or more years. Several Quarter Horse trainers have but that is another can of worms.

    The integrity of the sport is a sham. There are many ways, legally to stop the use of drugs, if those in charge really wanted to. I don’t disagree that trainers have right to appeal a suspension but the parameters need to be realigned.

    1. To speed up the process trainers would have thirty days to appeal a suspension and there should be only one appeal. They may or may not choose to have an attorney but if their appeal is denied, the suspension would begin immediately.

    2. The trainer would lose their stall allotment immediately upon the final edict.

    3. The horses under his/her care would be taken out the barn and could not be reassigned to anyone who worked under the trainer or is related to the trainer. Otherwise it is a shill game.

    4. Make the penalties severe enough as to discourage further use of drugs.

    5. Veterinarians involved should receive the same treatment by the stewards; suspension, fine or whatever. Trainers do not do this unaided. To think there is no vets who bend the rules is ludicrous.

    7. Caveat; None of this will happen.

    • yes master

      add #8 reciprocity between racing jurisdictions to your list
      and #9 no stay of the sanction during the appeal process….and for the record, Laurie D. Hall. I use the alias of Yes Master due to my Bar Association issues with commenting on blogs, and to avoid a First Amendment argument with them.

      • Jack Frazier

        Added

  • Garrett Redmond

    Gorder is represented by the best lawyer in town. That will ensure he has a fair hearing. So, hold all judgments until the verdict.

    • Peyton

      To heck with the best lawyer in town and you withhold your own judgment if it so pleases you, but I am on the side of the law in this one. If the authorities are not supported, then it just furthers the cheaters mentality. I for one am sick of all these false positive, another appeal and stay, contamination by poppy seeds and other such crap and I’m ready for a little vigilanty justice. And these so called high moral owners that say the man is without doubt totally innocent because they know him is just another line of BS. What that means to me is these high profile owners’ reputations’ are not so well deserved and their comments have lessened my respect for them.

  • JoeJoe

    Kellyn, you got busted. Do your time, admit you are wrong and in 14 months you will be back. If the horse finished last, would he still be suspended?

    • Greg J.

      Admit you are wrong is he is innocent?

      • JoeJoe

        They rarely ever admit when they are wrong. Just would be nice to fess up..,

        • Greg J.

          Fess up if guilty, fine, just not the case here.

  • In this entire thread there are less than 10 individuals with the courage to use their own names when posting comments, which accounts for some of the snarkiest, nastiest and absurd remarks one is likely to find on the Internet. Exactly what purpose this serves is something that I would like to have explained by Ray Paulick, an otherwise thoroughly admirable host and moderator who for reasons that mostly escape retains a blind spot when it comes to allowing people to post anonymously, thereby encouraging the taking of pot shots.

    • Greg J.

      Spot on.

    • Do You Know My Name

      Mr Irwin using ones so called name doesnt diminish the value of a comment ask “deep throat” and Bob Woodward. Nor does it detract form meaningful discourse to those who stick on the topic.

      Its 2015 on the internet i could be any name i wanted. So tell me please how would you vet and credential this so called names sir?

      • David

        Actually ‘Do you Know My Name’ recent peer-reviewed sociological research has found that anonymity does in fact substantially increase the rates of obscene, ridiculous commenting. So, in every empirically meaningful way, you are incorrect in your assessment.

        • Thanks David.

        • Do you Know My Name

          Please sir site your sources and studies in a meaningful way that helps clarify your clearly straw man argument. Better yet stay on topic please. Thank you.

          • David

            The clinical (academic term) is ‘Online Disinhibition Effect.’ And, this is precisely on topic. Your deepthroat example is an apples and oranges comparison for obvious reasons. But since you asked, here are a few (of many) relevant peer-reviewed studies.
            Suler, John (2004). “The Online Disinhibition Effect”. CyberPsychology & Behavior 7(3).
            Jump upBen-Ze’e v, Aaron (July 2003). “Privacy, emotional closeness, and openness in cyberspace”. Computers in Human Behavior 19 (4): 451–467.
            Jump up to:Postmas et al. (2002). “Behavior Online: Does Anonymous Computer Communication Reduce Gender Inequality?”. Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin 28 (8).
            Jump upRowe, I. (2015). “Civility 2.0: a comparative analysis of incivility in online political discussion”. Information, Communication & Society 18 (2): 121-138.
            Suler, John (2009). “The Bad Boys of Cyberspace: Deviant Behavior in a Multimedia Chat Community”. CyberPsychology & Behavior.

            Does this satisfy you?

          • Veddy noyce.

          • David

            It’s interesting Barry, ‘Do You Know My Name’ seems to have disappeared the minute the actual facts discredited his argument. Sure wish I knew his name so I could follow up. :)

      • A name carries weight and responsibility. If you cannot understand this I would be surprised. It is matter of conviction. It is not like we are revealing classified governmental information on this site. But names carry weight. They don’t have to be prominent names, but in due course, anybody’s name used over a long period of time establishes a person’s credibility. We are in a small community and anonymity encourages bad behavior and untruths to be written.

        • Keyne

          If anonymous posters are spreading libel,that is horribly bad.However,I love when people post EXACTLY what they feel on the Net because it takes the PC out of it and makes it REAL.I don’t want posters to be PC all the time.On the net,if you sift through some of the rubble,you get honestly(right or wrong) what people truly believe.I think that can be a good thing.
          I haven’t said anything contra to Mr Gorder as I don’t know him.But I know many people in my neck of the woods who swear they mask amphetamine usage with Lasix…….

          • Nonsense re anonymous posters. Why do you think they make witnesses put their hand on the Bible and swear to tell the truth? Get real. If you are looking for entertainment, then have fun on the Internet, but if you want sincere comments, them make people identify themselves.

          • Keyne

            “Make people properly identify themselves so they will make sincere comments”??Lolololol……I know many people who identify themselves who can lie,lie,lie without batting an eye.

        • Do You Know My Name

          I understand fully what you have said and agree to disagree. Its a very wide brush you paint with sir as responsibility and horse racing don’t seem to fit very well together in this day and age. It doesn’t take an ounce of real world courage to post here on the majority of topics.

          People make snarky comments for a variety of reasons most of which i couldn’t agree with either.

          A “name” will never ever stop or solve the internet trolls or validate what someone has typed. My name in horse racing adds zero validity to anything i say and could be deemed a potent liability.

          But i will tell you something sir no one regardless of their “name” is anonymous on the internet as there is this magic thing that identifies everyone its called an IP address.

    • David

      Hear, hear! (Or is it here, here?) Either way, right on, And, for the record, my last name is ‘Worley’ but I (unfortunately) signed up on Discus as ‘David’ but am now going to go in and change my profile in honor of this post. Hopefully others will do the same Barry.

      • 4Bellwether666

        Nobody really cares what your last name is so don’t fret about it…ty…

        • David

          Barry’s point is an excellent one; namely that anonymous posting produces highly irresponsible, ridiculous, and unhelpful comments by people hiding behind their posted name. If people actually had to stand by what they said with their actual embodied reputation, you’d see greater moderation and many more thoughtful posts.

          • 4Bellwether666

            Tell them to just take the bitter with sweet which comes with the freedom to run ones lips (fingers) right or wrong…

          • David Worley

            Bellwether & McGov; The wonderful thing about research is that you can actually substantiate what is happening in the world rather than just conjecturing what might be. The fact is that ‘online disinhibition effect’ (see my post on this article with the citations) has been proven to exist and in this particular context creates ridiculous commenting by people who cannot be held accountable. That, in my professional opinion, creates less valuable discussion.

            If your purpose for posting on the Paulick Report is to ‘run ones lips’ perhaps you should simply post a comment versus responding to one that is already established and attempting to make a coherent point.

            (Actually Ray Paulick, this is a good idea. How about two conversation strands, one for people intent on intelligent discussion and another for people who want to ‘run their lips.’)

          • McGov

            You sound like you don’t have a stake in the industry. Or you’re not in the middle.
            In either case, a moderator can deal with “highly irresponsible, ridiculous, and unhelpful comments”. Simple. The freedom of anonymity should be preserved.

          • David Worley

            See my response to Bellwether.

    • Jack Frazier

      I agree with you. If you don’t have the courage of your convictions then keep them to yourself. I have always distrusted anonymous posts.

    • Needles

      Someone needs to tell Barry that tracks have rules in place in their guides that state they can rule off individuals for comments made on forums such as this. He needs to get off his elite stool and understand why all don’t post their name. After all, this is a sport where people who speak the truth are villianized because the truth goes against the cheaters playbook to succeed.

      • Larry Ensor

        Personally I don’t have a problem if people use their given name or a screen name. I chose to use mine pretty much since the PR came into being. I figure given the fact I have been in and around the industry a long time and have a pretty good understanding of how things work. If people want to check out my background so as to give credence. Googling my name will bring up all kinds of “tid-bits” depending on how far they want to “dig”. My website has a “who-is” page. I agree with your comment by and large. As to Barry’s feelings on the subject, to each their own. I don’t have to agree with someone’s position that may be counter to mine to respect them.

        I have been told over the years directly or indirectly by some of the “powers that be” that I can be too out spoken about things I should not be so out spoken about. I would suspect, more like I know it has hampered my career in the business far more than it has helped. So be it. If I were to write the book on “the rest of the story” it would be an eye opener to many. But I feel it would serve no purpose for the “greater good” of the sport.

    • John G. Veitch

      Agreed Barry. I have a dog in this fight, as Kellyn trains one of my horses. From what I know about him, he’s dedicated and honest. I’ve only met him once, since he’s in KY. based & I’m here in Saratoga. W/O knowing the whole situation, and from afar, I find it difficult to believe he used the drug.

    • secondlife

      Anybody could get on here & post under a real name & pretend to be Bob Baffert or whoever else & there is NO way to verify who is and isn’t who they say they are. If Ray feels the need to delete any comments that are slanderous or insulting, he has every right to do so. Posting under real names would solve nothing and you can’t prove who they are anyway.

      • Totally incorrect. A simple registration process would eliminate the possibility of this from happening.

        • secondlife

          Not really. People are required to “register” on facebook, yet it’s entirely possible to open a facebook account with a fake name & fake photo easily obtainable on the internet or Getty Images. I know someone who has at least 2 fake facebook accounts, one of which has a profile photo of Batman.

          • David Worley

            Technically you are correct. But Barry’s point is that registration would make this more difficult and root out a lot of the nonsense.

            Personally, I really appreciate much of the conversation on the Paulick Report. I learn a ton and enjoy intelligent conversation. Providing anonymity incentivizes people to act badly and ‘dumbs down’ the conversation by allowing ridiculous comments that people wouldn’t make in person that detract from the constructive elements in the conversation strand.

        • KY RACE FAN

          YOU ARE INCORRECT!!!!

    • I agree with Barry on this. Pseudonyms are OK if the debate is light-hearted; and in the case of a whistleblower, it is necessary. When people are doubting the integrity of a trainer, if they don’t sign their real names to their posts, these are the acts of cowards (against which the trainer has no defense).

      As far as Ray and his staff is concerned, imagine the difficulty of enforcing a “real name only” edict. I could present myself as “Ray Flanagan” (or any other alias) and the odds are pretty good that there would be no way of knowing/discovering what my real name is.

      • They could do it. No problem. Other websites do it.

    • McGov

      I respectfully disagree. Anonymity provides a better discussion in my opinion. It is the function of the moderator to remove comments that are not appropriate.
      Not all of us have the freedom to use our names and if we were forced to use our names we simply wouldn’t participate or would do so in a different way.
      Only those at the top or the bottom have such freedoms. Those of us in the middle do not lest we think first of the repercussions of speaking freely….this is reality.
      A comment should be taken and assessed on it’s own….hold itself up so to speak. If people choose to abuse this privilege than not only can the moderator remove the abusive comment…they can also remove the commenter.
      Having said that…..I think it’s great that Barry Irwin comments here :)))

  • youcantmakeitup

    Regardless of the meth bad test, isn’t it illegal to have syringes and injectable meds around the barn? Its quacking and waddling but maybe it isn’t a duck.

  • Olly Stevens

    I am appalled by the lack of common sense, disregard for context and severity of this Judgement.

    My wife and I both worked for Kellyn for a number of years and his approach to training influences me daily now that I am running my own stable in England. He is quite simply the most wonderful horseman and the only edge he ever sought were through good horsemanship, husbandry and attention to detail.

    During my time working as his assistant I was not once asked to break one rule or administer any illegal medications, if anything I would say that Kellyn took a conservative approach towards medication and is a man that prefers to let the horses do the talking.

    Kellyn is the sort of trainer who would much rather see a horse settle in a race and run on late than administer an amphetamine and have the horse wild and out of control. By his own admission his previous infraction was down to human error and frightened him greatly, this hefty punishment suggests intent on Kellyn’s part which I suggest anyone that knows him would find impossible to believe.

    During the course of training and racing horses will come into contact with many employees, blacksmiths, private and state veterinarians, racing officials, gate crew, pony riders and public. Abuse of recreational drugs is unfortunately commonplace in our society and it staggers me that those who have handed down this punishment cannot conceive that human contact/contamination might have led to a minute amount of the offending chemical found in the horse’s blood sample. Not even near enough to effect performance.

    I urge everyone to support Kellyn in every way possible. He is a gifted trainer who has achieved a lot through his talent as a horseman, support from loyal owners and a hard working team.

    He is one of the good guys.

    • Keyne

      “Kellyn would rather see a horse settle than amp him up”??? Before he gut busted,Gorder had many first timers win that were “on the engine” from the start.Many trainers make big scores with their 1sters ,as they are the only ones who truly know when theyre ready.I have no clue if he made out at the windows,but he had many 1sters who didn’t”settle”….

      • Olly Stevens

        We all have first timers that can run a little free. The occasion of a race day is a lot for a young and unexposed horse to take in and it is very hard to predict how each horse will react to it.

        If we start to throw around accusations rather than praise for first time winners I would start to have concerns.

    • Needles

      Do you have syringes laying around your barn?

      • Olly Stevens

        No. but if you read Bill Casner’s piece below there is a credible explanation for the needle (To allow naxcel, an antibiotic, to be mixed with sterile water and administered via nebuliser)

        MY POINT IS THAT THIS IS NOT KELLYNS STYLE. People will no doubt try to sling mud but those of us who know him know that these comments are a long way off the mark.

        • Needles

          Just so I’m clear, if a guy is a good horseman and all around ‘good guy’ we should allow those trainers to possess needles at the racetrack?

          • Bubba

            Can’t be any worse than the vets. If trainers have the full “responsibility”, then they should be allowed.

          • 4Bellwether666

            Race tracks from coast to coast have been turning a blind eye to the SPIKES laying around the barns when in fact they are suppose to be only in the hands of a Lic. Vet…Didn’t they in fact bust Richard Dutrow for spikes in his barn???…

        • Tony Lacy

          Well said Olly! I have happy to stand up and defend Kellyn as a Horseman and Person.

    • Greg J.

      Thank you Mr. Stevens.

    • Danny Gonzalez

      Sorry to say but the cheaters in the game are not the trainers. There is going to keep being a rash of these kinds of positives unless the commision put a tighter grip on things

  • Needles

    Even if it was contamination. Any idiot trainer knows you can’t have injectables in a stable. If he’s such a class horseman, why does he need needles in his stable? He can’t hire a vet to treat his animals? I’m tired of the same old excuses and when someone is a ‘good guy’ and a ‘great horseman’ we want to give him a free pass. Sorry charlie, enjoy your year off, if nor nothing else the shear stupidity of having needles and injectables in your barn.

    • Larry Ensor

      I understand what you are saying and it a fair argument. I would bet the vast majority of trainers have syringes and certain necessary meds within short reach. The VAST majority that do, it is NOT for nefarious purposes. Vets are not always readily available when time maybe of the essences. Anyone that has worked closely with horses knows exactly what I mean.

      As a horseman and “bill payer” it is really annoying to get charged $30-50 for a vet to give my horse something that cost pennies. In a “perfect world” I would like to see tracks have an on site non profit pharmacy. Where trainers can “pick-up, sign out” certain medications that are necessary in the day to day operation of any stable. It would save owners a lot of money. My owners would freak out if I called a vet every time their horse needs certain meds at my farm. $50 for the “farm call” alone. My vets know me and my skill level and have no problem giving me the meds requested and or writing a scrip so I can order on line at a great savings to my owners/clients.

      If a non horse person walked into my kitchen or tack room they may find numerous syringes laying on the counter. I am sure they would think I must be some kind of drug addict. When you have a lot of horses there are various reasons to give injections on any given day. A number of which end up in my jacket pocket and get “dumped out” at the end of many long days. Sometime they go straight into the garbage some times they don’t.

      I got pulled over one time coming back from a breeding run and my trailer lights weren’t working. The mare had been given a med and I just threw the syringe in my “change tray” with out giving it a thought. Well, the cop’s eyes lit up when he saw it. Fortunately he was pretty understanding after I explained. Though I am pretty sure it would have been different if I didn’t have a horse on board. I know he didn’t want to deal with the horse if he had arrested me.

      I “just” threw the syringe in “plain site” because it was not being used for nefarious reasons. And IMO this is exactly the reason Mr. Gorder did not “hide” his.

      People that do things for nefarious reasons cover their tracks.

      • Needles

        Fair points. Agreed. But there are several things here building against Gorder being a clean trainer. If nothing else, he’s a poor manager of his stable and should consider downsizing to a group of 15-20 horses so he can manage things better.

  • Figless

    Maybe it just me but whenever I see a positive for a human recreational drug like Meth I give the trainer the benefit of the doubt. Its so easy for a horse to be contaminated, on the track, in the barn, outriders, owners, anyone of many people that come in contact with a horse that do not work for the trainer. If just one of them has a drug habit it is easily transferred.
    Then when I read that the contamination level is miniscule and the trainer has had only one overage in 14 years prior to this incident, it furthers my suspicion this was accidental.
    I am all for strong tough lasting penalties that dissuade cheating, and do not know the trainer, but I say he deserves his day in court and lean skeptical in this particular situation.

    • Needles

      Your thoughts on having syringes in the barn? Is that okay?

      • Figless

        It certainly confuses the situation and needs to be adjudicated. Ands it depends what they found in the syringe. If its meth he is guilty, if it indeed is antibiotic then perhaps pure coincidence, which, believe it or not, does happen.

        • Needles

          You are not allowed to have syringes in the barn even if you are using them to inject water in the veins. Every condition book from Fairmount Park to Emerald Downs clearly states this.

          • 5times5

            You know….I was actually given permisson by stews per vet request to be allowed to have syringes at my barn for a couple weeks to save a horse’s eye. They were marked in a specific way (which probably could have been copied). We were having to run an antibiotic solution thru a tiny tube in a sewn closed eye about evrry 2 hours. Without that special permission….better follow the rules….or accept the consequences.

  • Tony Lacy

    I have had horses in-training with Kellyn over the last few years and have gotten to know him personally and professionally. I have as some would know, I have recommended him to people who demand the best. I have the highest respect for him as a person and as a horseman.

    I was in his barn a couple of years ago when he had a horse test positive for Clenbuterol and he was genuinely shaken from it – not a person who was caught cheating, but someone shocked at how it could have been given to that horse. He tightened up further his procedures to combat it happening again. He did not appeal it, but accepted that somehow it has gotten into that horses system – albeit unintentionally. And who in their right mind would give Meth to a horse!?! In addition the traces were so small it has to be a result of contamination from someone in contact with the horse or it’s feed.

    To read this news this morning is so far out of context, it is hard to grasp. As Olly Stephens and Bill Casner have stated today, people of the highest morals themselves, this is obviously something that was not intentional in any way. I too am very much a non-medication advocate and give my full support to Kellyn.

    • Needles

      What’s your excuse of him having syringes and injectables in addition to the meth positive? Are you okay with trainers being able to possess these on the backside?

      • Tony Lacy

        There are situations where injectable drugs maybe needed in a barn for emergency situations, severe colic for example. So I can not comment on those unidentified ‘injectables’ as it would be speculation. If Naxcel (an antibiotic for bacterial phenomena) was said to be used for a nebulizer (an inhaler), it would be for therapeutic reasons. The main issue was Meth, and the severity of the sentence was based on that, which I find disturbing.
        Kellyn stopped training a very talented horse of our because he felt he saw very slightly changes in a tendon, and he was right. Some may have tried to get through the next big race – that’s not the type of person he is! He’s a true horseman!

        • Needles

          Thanks for ducking the question. A good horseman employs a vet who is available 24/7 for emergencies.

          • David Hager

            Ya right. Vets are not able to be around every horse in their practice 24/7 for TREATMENTS. They will come for emergencies, but they will prescribe treatments for sick horses that horsemen have to carry out. This would include injectables, like Naxcel, or oral medications, like Doxycycline for example. I absolutely am okay with trainers possessing medications that vets prescribe to treat our horses that are sick. This is what they are supposed to do if they care for our horses. Kellyn has had a horse for me as well, and he cares very much about every horse in his barn. The trace contamination amount of the meth, which you say is a positive, was only that. Granted, that is a positive, but to indicate that Kellyn is a cheater based on a trace amount is asinine. Turn your attention to the real cheaters, that have real positives that are trying to cheat the business. We need your help there.

          • Needles

            You do realize the “real cheaters” use the exact same excuses right? And yes, they have plenty of people come to their defense as well. Look how many came on here to defend Dutrow. There’s always an excuse…

          • David Hager

            I am curious as to who you are. How involved are you in the horse business? You and other postings show a bandwagon affect of jumping aboard and bashing someone no matter the circumstances. I will ask you a simple question to try and correlate your point above with your own experience. When you are sick, and have gone to a physician, who has diagnosed your symptoms, and then prescribed medication to you for that treatment, do you go back to that physician every dose of every day that you need to take it so that the physician can give it to you? Or does the physician send a licensed practitioner to you to administer the medication to you? I doubt it because physicians are not able to handle that treatment that way. They prescribe the medication, and give you instructions on how and when to take it. Then you are responsible to take the medication as instructed to treat yourself in order to get better. There is no difference in Kellyn’s vet prescribing the medication needed for a sick horse in his care, and Kellyn being responsible for carrying out the treatment for the horses sake and for the owner. This is the real world. Sure cheaters will use excuses, that’s human. They aren’t going to admit cheating, they have to be caught. Proper testing, and investigating have to be utilized. So is Kellyn guilty of cheating? He was following vet’s instructions for treating a sick horse, hence the medicines and syringes in the barn; and, a horse tested positive to a prohibited substance, but at such a small trace amount that strongly suggests contamination instead of “cheating” for a race. I can’t see how you would think he is guilty of cheating when you look at the facts. Very different case than actual cheaters don’t you think? And would you even actually concede this point or rather just continue arguing a point that is not there just for the sake of arguing?

          • Tony Lacy

            I am not ducking questions or being anonymous. As someone who has witnessed horses with severe colics in the past, and similar emergencies, minutes are crucial. Vets can sometimes be 20 minutes away. And as I said, me (or anyone) commenting on unspecified ‘injectables’ is just speculation. The core of the issue for Kellyn has been a ‘Meth’ positive in one of his horses, and minute traces at that! Does this not scream contamination!?! It is very easy to try and destroy a good person’s character when they are at their weakest. I am happy to stand up for someone who I know is trustworthy. I can’t not defend someone who breaks the law knowingly, but will defend someone who I believe has been unjustly vilified.

          • Needles

            Graham Motion has never had a Clen Buterol positive>
            Graham Motion has never had a meth positive.
            Graham Motion has never been caught with unlabled medications.
            Graham Motion has never been caught with needles/Syringes at a racetrack.

            I think you are missing my point. Part of being a good / clean trainer is practicing what you preach. And part of what people like Graham Motion a better horseman that people like Gorder is he knows how to manager a large stable so these things would never happen.

  • John Scheinman

    I want to comment on the anonymous poster question: I have a friend who has an enormously popular regional boxing blog. The comment section, practically from the get-go, was a war zone. All sorts of trash talk and denigration, but also fierce arguments and debate. It was a cauldron of conversation, good, bad and ugly. The friend decided he’d seen too much when a few bad eggs crossed the line, and he put a registration system in that required people to identify themselves. Now, no one comments at all and the blog has lost a lot of its vibrancy because of it. I always post my name because if I can’t say it in public I probably shouldn’t say it at all. Others, however, feel freer to speak anonymously, and, for me, that’s OK. This whole sad situation with Kellyn Gorder has me scratching my head because as opinionated as I am, these kinds of murky issue in racing leave me without a position. I can’t bring myself to throw in with anybody because I just don’t know. So, I continue to observe and read and listen and, hopefully, learn. I would suggest anyone making accusations have the facts to back them up, but opinions should fly freely. Have at it!

    • Peyton

      We have the facts. The man was suspended for a drug violation(Class1) and hypodermic needles and drugs were found in his barn. All those things are against any racing jurisdiction’s rules and are punishable by fine and suspension. All this other crap about using your real name and ‘he can’t be guilty because he’s my personal friend’ is just stinking red herring.

      • John Scheinman

        I understand that we “have the facts,” Peyton. I would suggest that all trainers set up camera systems around their barns to monitor everyone’s movements in the vicinity. Even if they don’t work, they will act as a deterrent to bad things.

        • Peyton

          The commissions and stewards have a job to do and they did it. Also a rule for many, if not all jurisdictions, is the trainer is ultimately responsible for what is done to his horses with or without his knowledge. If cameras are needed to help a trainer fulfill that responsibility then that is up to him.

          • John Scheinman

            Peyton, I’m not going to get into a pissing match, but I get the sense you’re talking to me as if I’ve somewhere said Gorder got a bad rap. I have no opinion on this. I appreciate your passion, but I do not need to be taught by you about how horse racing works.

          • Peyton

            You made the comment that posts be done with facts. And so my response about the facts. Then you suggested ‘all trainers install cameras’ which is like you saying all trainers should rub their horses before a race. My response is its the trainers responsibility to do what’s necessary for his horses within the rules. This is not teaching you horse racing, its steering you toward developing a logical opinion which you may want to use to help make positive changes to the sport.

        • 5times5

          You cannot believe what things went on at my barn thst I was unaware of till I got a camera system. Started back in about 2000 I guess.

      • Peyton, you are as per usual, talking out of the wrong orifice. Gorder was given permission to have syringes in his barn as part of the protocol to treat a horse with a cyst on its throat with a nebulizer. He got in trouble for failure to discard them. The trace amount of meth found in the bloodstream was in picograms not even nanograms. Kellyn will get off on this. You watch and see.

        • Peyton

          ‘He got in trouble’ for breaking the rules. Your suggestion that he forgot to discard the evidence is only an excuse. Just like the contamination statement he and so many others have used. He probably will get off.

        • Lynn

          “Gorder was given permission to have syringes in his barn as part of the
          protocol to treat a horse with a cyst on its throat with a nebulizer”.

          Are you sure about this?

          In the ARCI MODEL RULES, promoted by some of your favorites (RMTC & The Jockey Club), no one other than a licensed veterinarian can have in their possession or use needles, syringes, or injectable medications on the grounds under the control of the racing commission.

          Having a veterinarian available 24 hours a day, 365 days a year is NOT likely an option. It would be in the best interest of the horse to permit a trainer to treat a horse with a necessary prescribed medication. This should include when necessary injectable medications such as the antibiotic Naxcel. However common sense for the best interest of the horse isn’t so common.

        • David Hager

          I don’t have a password so I have to enter as a guest. My name is David Hager. Thanks Barry for calling it like it is. There are so many people on this site that posts comments without knowing facts. I don’t see anything wrong with giving a shot to a horse that a vet prescribes, nor giving oral medicines to a horse that a vet prescribes. I have had a horse in training with Kellyn, and he is a very upstanding person, and trainer that cares a lot for his horses. He is a good person, good horseman, and good trainer. To see a 14 month suspension handed out to Kellyn for a trivial contamination positive is a crime in itself. That is a fact. I also believe that Kellyn will prevail in this case, as he should. He is not a cheater, but a good horseman that our business needs to have around. There are plenty of trainers that are cheaters, and they need to be dealt with harshly, but Kellyn is not one of those. I know that Kellyn’s owners will stand behind him fully, as they know this to be a fact as well.

        • Michael Rosencrants

          Again I hope he does. I think this creates an opportunity though. I can’t know what a person is or is not capable of or what is in their heart and mind. I am not a judge or jury but the perception of the industry is bad and something must be done. If the test levels are so ambiguous that false accusations are the norm and innocent people are hurt and the industry is maligned then where are the demands for acceptable tests, levels and circumstances that remove doubt from the public mind. Whether you believe Mr Gorder is innocent or Tom Amoss or even Roman Chapa. There has to be some line drawn that is enforceable. At this point any time one of these stories breaks anyone remotely connected to racing can tell you what the response, excuse and outcome will be.

        • John G. Veitch

          Yes he will. As it turns out, one of his employees was taking Sudafed to treat allergies. Sudafed is used to manufacture methamphetamine.

          • val

            So I guess this employee was not amongst all of his employes that got tested and all tested clean

          • John G. Veitch

            I’m sure the employee was tested, and advised the testing agency he (or she) was taking Sudafed. The employee test would have shown all constituent ingredients of Sudafed. where as the horse test JUST looks for the Meth, and not active ingredients of Sudafed. You raise a good point though…

      • snowy19

        Could have not put it better! These comments sound like a soap opera. They sound like type of misfits that call talk radio and watch espn.

  • Natalie Voss

    A reminder that readers commenting under multiple usernames will be banned. Find our commenting policies here: http://www.paulickreport.com/commenting-policies/

  • TJ Smith

    I believe Mr. Gorder is guilty of having a needle and of nothing else.

    • Peyton

      So you choose to ignore the meth positive and the unlabeled drugs found along with the needle? One out of three aint bad? Where is your logic behind your belief?

      • Jesus Oviedo

        Unlabeled oral drugs is nit picking. It could be bute in a cup rather than in a bottle labeled “Bute”. It obviously was not an illegal drug or they would have mentioned as so.
        I do not know this trainer so I am not taking up for him, just think getting in trouble for legal unlabeled drugs is ridiculous..

        • Peyton

          So you are addressing the unlabeled drugs with rationalization and still ignore the meth positive. Two out of three aint bad?

  • secondlife

    Just out of curiosity, does meth actually get used on race horses ever and if so for what reason? What would the benefit supposedly be?

    And I don’t know much about this particular trainer personally, but speaking from experience sometimes there is a difference between being a “nice guy” and a good horseman, and having good management skills when it comes to business, time and people management, etc. If you want to know what a particular barn is really like on a daily basis, ask a hot walker or groom, they know everything.

  • martymar

    It’s a witch hunt, it’s not a trainer with out of this world winning percentage and as far as I’m aware of I haven’t heard any horses broke down under his care nor have I read any inappropriate behaviour. I do hope good trainers doesn’t suffer when people like DAS/Jacobson killing horses in New York, O’neil in California.

  • KrissyM

    This drug does not make sense to me. Why? As far as syringes are concerned I do have several locked in my house for horse meds for an emergency. A shot of banamine for colic given early can mean the difference between life and death while waiting on the vet.. My only issue with this is if someone hates your guts and wants you gone they can put dope in the water, hay or mint or treat. Unfortunately, I think it is time for security cameras in all barns and walkways. All vet procedures should be video taped so there is no question what was done and viles randomly sampled. Loyalty and ethics dont exist in todays workplace. Someone hands your employee more cash than they have ever seen they can be bought. Most people would put family needs before an employer. Just have a hard time believing that someone who knows a horse is going to be tested can be so dumb and try to get away with something like this

  • Needles

    How is his % in 2015 (post positive) compared to 2014 and before pre positive? Seems like a solid dip to me.

  • Cory Patton

    I have taken care of ship in runners in Chicago for several years and at no time have I had any indication that he doesn’t run an absolutely by the book operation. In this case contamination is the only possible explanation.

  • Sean Damron

    Think about Keeneland and the Thoroughbred Center. A motivated person could tamper with a hundred horses in an hour. I’m surprised this isn’t happening on a large scale. A few packs of Nicotine gum and a person could ruin the Keeneland meet and destroy the reputation of dozens of trainers.

    I am a co-owner of DamronCams, which provides video security to Thoroughbred horse farms and racing stables. Many disturbing stories of tampering never reach the media.

    • Needles

      Ray is going to invoice you $150 for this advertisement. But your point is valid. You are dumb if you don’t have security cameras in a barn these days.

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