PLEASE DON’T CALL ME BLACKJACK
By Ray Paulick
Am I getting soft? Was that really a tear rolling down my cheek when David “Please Don’t Call Me Blackjack” Williams, the Republican President of the Kentucky Senate, told me his opposition to slot machines at racetracks has resulted in him being demonized, cost him longtime friends, and caused his name to be taken off Christmas card lists throughout the Commonwealth.
Williams is a shrewd politician, and though I may have been born yesterday, it wasn’t last night. I’m not falling for the “victim” act.
I do, however, give Williams credit for showing up in Lexington April 27 at the Kentucky International Equine Summit, sponsored by the Equine Industry Program at the University of Louisville College of Business in cooperation with the Equine Initiative at the University of Kentucky College of Agriculture.
Williams listened to various presentations and panel discussions on the state of the Thoroughbred industry. The Burkesville, Ky., native also took time for some hallway banter with a pesky reporter whose nickname for him—“Blackjack,” derived from his widely discussed trips to out-of-state casinos—rankles the senator to no end.
In fact he began our “conversation” quite combatively, accusing me of slurring his good name. But he calmed down and was generous with his time, sharing his thoughts, as misguided as I think some of them are, about various aspects of the industry.
During a discussion entitled “New Business Models for Racetracks,” I asked the panelists—Louis Cella of Oaklawn Park, Nick Eaves of Woodbine Entertainment Group, and Chris McErlean of Penn National Gaming—what the future was for racing in states like Kentucky that had no form of revenue other than traditional pari-mutuel wagering. The answers were blunt. “Their days are numbered,” said Cella. “Over,” said Eaves. “Ditto,” said McErlean.
At the conclusion of that session, I caught up with Williams and asked if, given what those panelists said, he had concerns about the future of horse racing and breeding in Kentucky. Following is the transcript of our exchange:
Williams: “If I didn’t have concerns about the future of the industry I wouldn’t be here. I’ve been here all day. I didn’t just attend this one session, I’ve attended the other sessions and I’m going to attend another one. The one on advance deposit wagering was very interesting and I would submit that these guys (Cella, Eaves, and McErlean) are losing money on racing and they are just using racing as an excuse to have slots. They are the ones who have skewered the system that prevents anyone from succeeding. Ultimately these folks will get out of the racing industry. They are losing money on racing. I would like someone to ask them why they even have racing.”
Paulick: I wouldn’t say that about Oaklawn Park, which has been in the racing business for 100 years, and Woodbine is actually a not-for-profit required to put money into the racing and breeding industry.
Williams: “Oaklawn Park can’t have slot machines. The bottom line of it is, the gentleman from Arkansas said they can’t have anything but pari-mutuels (Instant Racing machines, created at Oaklawn Park, resemble slot machines, but the wagering on previously run races is pari-mutuel).
Those other folks are only in the racing business so they can have slots. They would close their racing operations if they could. They’ve already reduced their number of days. I would propose to you that any business that you are in if you can reduce the number of days racing and make more money, there’s a problem with the business model. So there is a problem in the business model of racing, but the problem didn’t just start with slot machines. The problem started with advance deposit wagering and OTB.
“You’ve said everything in the world about me personally and people have done everything they can to get me out, but it’s my obligation as president of the Senate of Kentucky to try and help this industry, and I think about it every week.”
Paulick: You don’t appear to be much of a horse racing supporter.
Williams: “I don’t criticize anybody who wagers,. I don’t criticize anyone who goes to a horse race. The bottom line of it is these people here were the wrong people here to ask that question about the future of racing in Kentucky, they are in racing only so they can justify having slots.”
Paulick: Do you want me to ask that question of Bob Evans (CEO of Churchill Downs Inc.)?
Williams: “He’s not for racing, either. Bob Evans is a person who is trying to maximize the profit for a publicly held corporation, and I’ve never criticized him for that. What I believe he is doing is not in the best interest of racing. I believe these slot machines will destroy racing or diminish racing. What we have to do is get folks who are involved in horse farms—the breeders and the folks who own the horses—we have to give them a bigger share of the pie. The economics of advance deposit wagering are fascinating.”
Paulick: It does seem pretty clear that Churchill is trying to move as much wagering as possible to their ADW platform, where they get a higher percentage than from on-track bets.
Williams: “They do. By doing that they also take down the pari-mutuel tax from 3.5% to 1.5%. And then they use incentives to get the whales (large bettors), and now they have the offshore people in addition to that.
“I’m going to invite the members of that panel (entitled “ADW as a Creative Disruption,” David Basler, Ohio HBPA; consultant Will E. Cummings, David Llewellyn, president Wyvern International/Australian Racing) to come to the National Legislative Caucus. We want to get all the racing states together, and the Council of State Governments is working behind the scenes. We are going to try to replicate some of these panels in Louisville when we meet.
“We want to get all the racing states together to increase the level of cooperation and we believe we can do it. New York’s taking the lead on it, in trying to establish an interstate compact, from top to bottom. A Thoroughbred association is setting up an alliance. There is legislation in New York being introduced. I believe we will have within two or three years a national organization associated through the Council of State Governments. Right here in Lexington we have the Association of Interstate Compacts. Put the 38 racing states together and not in a mandatory regulatory system but in all the areas they can agree on and have uniform laws. We are making some progress along those lines.”
Paulick: What you’re talking about is going to take years, and there’s no guarantee it will ever amount to anything. Meanwhile, all these other racing states have added slots, increased purses, and are attracting horses from Kentucky.
Williams: “How long will they subsidize purses if they lose money on racing? They like to use the agricultural excuse. But I would ask these states, if any one of you with slots could do away with racing, would you do it? If they said they would not do it they would be breaching their fiduciary duty to stockholders, wouldn’t they?”
Paulick: It sounds like you want to put the toothpaste back in the tube.
Williams: “I’m doing what I think is right and trying to help the industry, and I don’t appreciate you getting personal about it.”
Paulick: The only personal thing is when you go to gamble at casinos out of state, and then you come back to Kentucky and take a stand against VLTs at racetracks, I think you’re being a hypocrite.
Williams: “I don’t go to casinos any more.”
Paulick: Why not?
Williams: “Because I have soured on the entire gambling industry. It’s the reason I don’t drink as much as when I was in college, you know what I mean. The bottom line of it is these people in my opinion have no conscience and I don’t like to participate in it. And as far as being hypocritical, I don’t criticize people who want to participate. Socially, I just think the cost of it is more than it’s worth.
“Let me give you an example. When (Democratic House Speaker Greg) Stumbo and those guys passed that gambling deal, they committed more money for 20 years than the state was going to get. We weren’t going to get any money to the bottom line because they had to buy votes to get that passed. And they didn’t even try to get it passed this time.
“This year when we flirted with Instant Racing, you saw what (Democratic House Speaker Pro Tem) Larry Clark said. He said it was a non-starter, we were never going to pass it. Larry Clark said if they want Instant Racing they’ve got to come to me sometime early in the session.
“You say I’m the one responsible for killing the thing, but the bottom line is there’s never been the votes over there. You know that now because after it was over (Senate Minority Leader) Ed Worley and those guys admitted there weren’t enough Democrats to join. But all the time, I’ve been demonized because I wouldn’t call it for a vote.
“I want to help the racing industry. I’ve done everything I could. I’ve done everything I could for the Breeders’ Cup. I’ve done everything we can for Churchill. We’ve lowered the pari-mutuel tax to 1.5% for the smaller tracks. I’m doing everything for the Council of State Governments that I can. I just want to help the racing industry. I don’t have anything personally against Churchill Downs. They’re just in a different situation with what they are trying to do with their Twin Spires ADW.
“What I want is the people who put on the show to get more of the money. I want the people who raise the horses, the people who race the horses, the people who buy the horses to get their fair share for putting on the show. And if you look at this account wagering thing, the folks who set up ADW were forward thinkers and a lot of the other people didn’t think it was going to become as big as it is, and they’re not getting their share. It’s hard to unscramble that egg. These are all things we have to deal with.
“But I guarantee you I am still convinced we can come up with a way to have a very healthy racing circuit in the state. For example, I think all four of the tracks ought to get together and brand Kentucky racing. Look what they’ve done with Australian racing. They talk about the quality. If we could take our purses up enough, we would have a high enough number of horses in every race to have exotic betting, because that’s what sells on the advance deposit wagering. They want full fields with quality horses.
“Now, would Churchill make as much if we did that? No. Would Keeneland make as much as it could? No. But my question is this: Is our goal to have a healthy racing circuit and a healthy racing industry here or is our goal to take money from our people and give it to the investors? That’s not my goal. My goal is to do what is necessary to have a healthy racing circuit, healthy farms here. My goal is not to proliferate slot machines. I just don’t see how anyone could say that putting 5,000 or 6,000 slot machines in Louisville would be good for anybody. It won’t be good for the city.”
Paulick: There’s an awful lot of slot machines just across the river from Louisville in Indiana.
Williams: “If I could do something about Indiana, I would, but the proximity of those slot machines (in Louisville) will increase the amount of gambling. And you and I both know the socio-economic group of people that hurts—and I’m not trying to protect them from themselves. People say I’m trying to be paternalistic. I’m trying to protect the rest of us from what happens when people participate in that—the proliferation of crime and the social ills that come with it.
“If it was to my benefit to take the position I’ve taken on this, I could understand why you’d criticize me. But what have I gotten from my position, except to be disparaged and lose friends I’ve had since college. To have hundreds of thousands of dollars spent to try and take me out. So you can’t say I have any motive to do this. I mean, what motive do I have? I’ve been taken off more Christmas cards lists than I’ve been on.”
Tags: chris mcerlean, david williams, Equine Industry Program, Equine Initiative, instant racing, Kentucky International Equine Summit, kentucky senate, Louis Cella, Nick Eaves, oaklawn park, Penn National Gaming, university of kentucky, University of Louisville, Woodbine Entertainment
May 6th, 2010 at 6:52 am
I must be retarded, because everytime this guy opens his mouth, I agree with what he says. I have never voted for a Republican in my life, but I would vote for this guy. He sees the big picture, as opposed to those mired down in the muck that has been perpetrated by the wrong interests for all of the wrong reasons. He is looking to throw us a lifeline, instead of others that would toss us a life preserver weighted down with lead.
May 6th, 2010 at 6:59 am
If all he loses is a few Christmas cards, then he will have come out of this mess he created pretty well.
What would his attitude be if Kentucky’s racing and breeding industries were say a Toyota factory? Bring on the subsidies and give them everything they want, of course. But racing is different. It does not deserve help. Similar in Maryland: Hey you want a new baseball stadium, we will build it and they will come. When racing and breeding industries need help, politicians have a funny habit of acting dumb. New York is a pretty good example of that as well.
I still don’t get what Williams really wants out of all this. Perhaps he himself does not know anymore. What I sense is his own stubbornness has locked him into a position where he cannot go back and he cannot go forward. And Kentucky will suffer because of it.
May 6th, 2010 at 7:07 am
I have to applaud this guy. Like everyone else in racing I know in my heart this slot mania is wrong. And I know Williams is right about corporate track management not giving a damn about racing. You just need to visit Philadelphia Park for a day to see that clearly. And I have witnessed a poor woman on the floor of the casino there in tears screaming at her gambling addicted husband who told her he was going to work. As a small time owner breeder I know only too well about the “people who put on the show” issue. You get a paltry $150 for running a horse that doesn’t hit the board while the ADW’s walk off with the profit.
Slots and casinos are not going to save racing. If some nice family goes to see the Secretariat movie this fall and gets their curiosity whetted about a day at the races would a visit to a racetrack fulfill their dreams?
I like the direction Williams is taking. That council of governors interstate cooperation initiative could well be the way to go.
It’s going to be painful without the quick fix but I’d rather see racing authority in the hands of people who care rather than “maximize the profits from this facility” public corporations.
May 6th, 2010 at 7:09 am
Mr. Williams is right and please look at what is happening in West Virginia with each passing day. Kentucky could have more tracks like Kentucky Downs and Keeneland that host short, high quality, wonderful racing and really reward those with a stake in the industry and weed out those who can’t afford to be in it. In the meantime, REMOVE the “empty, bogus marketers” of the “sport” currently responsible for pinning all hopes for the future of racing, sales and breeding to the casino gambling and slots. Mr. Williams is just like Nick Nicholson. They both know how crazy it is to think that we can walk down this the easy, short-term path … and so does every other person who is responsible (means response - able, most in our in our industry are not response able because they are so greedy). Thank you Mr. Williams for your fortitude and wisdom and your idea will win the hearts of the wise and thoroughbred racing will become a sport again in Kentucky because of your stand. Does the NFL or the NBA or the NHL make their living from gambling profits? This is a sport that is filled with human drama just like the Olympics and if you don’t believe it, then what just happened on Saturday with Super Saver and WinStar and Todd Pletcher and Calvin Borel and Elliott Walden and to all of their families and friends. That is what this whole “business” is all about. I grew up in Pittsburgh and have never bet on a Steelers game. I love horseracing and it has nothing to do with gambling. I pray for all of you who want to destroy the sport with other forms of gambling.
May 6th, 2010 at 7:24 am
Ray - great job in taking the time and making the effort to conduct and post the interview. It’s refreshing to see a thorough back-and-forth discussion of issues. Great solutions come from full discussion, complete facts, and in depth analysis. They seldom come from emotional diatribes. Thanks for all the info you provide.
May 6th, 2010 at 7:43 am
Blackjack knows the clock is ticking. He is going to be content to just let the clock run out. And when the clock does run out future 20 horse Kentucky Derby fields will have 4 Kentucky breds and not 16 Kentucky breds like Derby 136. Put a slots referendum on the November ballot and let the voters decide. By the way Ray, I congratulate you on tracking down Blackjack and getting him to speak with you. Did you happen to ask him about reducing the takeout? Let’s see what could happen to Kentucky racing if we could drop the take to 9 or 10% across the board for a 24 month period. The average horseplayer does not understand how the takeout effects their bankroll. The big players, “the whales” as Mr. Williams says, however, do understand the take. And the whales would make Kentucky racing with the low takeout their home track. This would increase handle and purse money.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:03 am
Why was Christopher McErlean on a panel about racing? He does not have a clue about how to run racing. Just look at their simulcast graphics which haven’t changed in probably 10 years. He’s just bucking for a gig on the gaming side when they phase out racing in the next five years.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:06 am
Has anyone stopped to consider that Mr. Williams may be obtaining quasi-legal, or even downright illegal, incentives to keep gaming out of Kentucky, possibly by interests in bordering states that want to keep Kentuckians coming to their states to gamble? Mr. Williams has already denied these allegations vehemently, and he is correct that, at this time, there exists no specific or overt evidence that this is the case. However, if he wants to continue to deny these allegations and to dismiss them permanently, then he must open up the books of his law firm to a full and complete audit and disclose who his clients are and/or have been for the last 10 years.
Mr. Williams will argue this is not permissible under the laws of attorney-client privilege, and I would agree with him if he were strictly an attorney with a law practice, but this is not the case. Mr. Williams is an attorney with a law practice who also happens to be the most powerful legislator in the state. As such, he must be held to higher standards of accountability to ensure he has never betrayed the public trust that has been vested to him to protect. He must prove to the world finally and unequivically that his positions are truly formed by philosophy and not by monetary incentive.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:18 am
Kentucky’s politics and horse racing industry could provide a national primer for the pervasiness of conflict of interest.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:46 am
I just don’t see how horse racing will get rid of the whales who play with the huge rebates. Tracks and ADW’s are scared out of their minds if they got rid of rebates that the whales would disappear. The only way to get rid of whales is to reduce takeout on exotic wagers to about 18 percent. ADW’s like Youbet are known to have these whales.
It is amazing that small tracks only receive as little as 3 % for every out of state wager. Horse racing biggest mistake the last 30 years was on how the simulcasting model was formulated with tracks getting the minority share of every dollar wagered and the bet taker getting the majority share. The people who put on the show (host track and horsemen) get peanuts. Theoretically, a small track who has a million in handle with a 3 % rate gets only 30,000 for purses? Yikes. Ten years ago. Tracks could make it up in simulcasting but now more and more people are betting online so the smaller tracks are taking it on both ends. The ADW’s are huge business. Churchill bought YouBet and AmericaTab and Betfair bought TVG.
There are too many states have slots which boost purse money. If u don’t have the slots then you are behind the 8 ball on the purse money. Horsemen in Kentucky already have left for States like Indiana, Pennsylvania, and Delware who have slots. Breeding operations in KY are leaving too.
If Kentucky got slots and instituted them the right way then Kentucky would be in control. The Kentucky legislature could put in safeguards so horse racing isn’t moved to the back of the bus. Make sure the purses make Kentucky the number one racing state in the country. Make sure the drug testing and other protective services are adequately funded. Make sure that the tracks spend an ample amount on marketing and promotion (on horses and the track). Make sure the slots money is INVESTED into the racing. These other states (Dela, IND, and Penn) haven’t done that successfully. These other states went from “small” racing states to “medium” racing states. They did what they had to survive.
Senator Williams is at least listening which is a start.
Great article Ray!!!!! It is for interviews like that on why I stop off at paulickreport every day.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:51 am
“Ditto”—– by Chris Mcerlean. What a profound commentary on the state of racing. That must have been taken from the same manual that was used to train PENN’s on site little general, rob marella. Next weeks lesson — HOW TO SPELL HORSE
May 6th, 2010 at 8:57 am
I agree with some posters here that the comments from Senator Williams seem reasonable. But then one remembers that Williams has been President of the Senate for what, eleven or twelve years now? And in that time, what legislation has he sponsored to assist the industry? What innovations has he supported to help stabilize our purse structure? For more than a decade, he has done nothing but offer obstacles and nasty rhetoric. And now that he is feeling an immense amount of pressure, he tells us that he thinks about the industry every day. Great! So where are the solutions? How do we get tens of millions into purses and breeders incentives without additional revenue?
And look what just happened during the last session. Senator Williams came out in support of Instant Racing as a means to help the industry. But when the family foundation made some noise in opposition, Williams and his Senate followers immediately folded. We all know that the family foundation would just as soon run us all out of the state, so if Williams and crew are so beholden to them, what chance do we have to pass meaningful legislation as long as they are still in charge?
In the past, Williams did not even bother to pay our industry lip service. Now that the industry has fought back, he feels like he needs to make these reasonable sounding kind of remarks, because he is a good politician. But until real action is taken, it is still nothing more than lip service.
May 6th, 2010 at 9:13 am
For more than forty years I have operated casino properties both large and small and also been involved in horse racing and breeding. It is evident that the racing and breeding model is horribly broken and in need of major repair and paradigm thinking. Those under whose watch the industry has stumbled from a combination of pure lack of skill to greed are hardly the people who will solve the problems. In some cases, they ARE the problem. Are slots or VLTs the answer? Perhaps in a few isolated places but generally they are a band-aid to temporarily move the problems down line a few more years. First fix the attraction. Then look at ancillary sources of revenue like slots or whatever. Barry Irwin is right and Williams is at least cognizant of the real underlying problems facing the industry. Slots/VLTs alone are not the solution.
May 6th, 2010 at 9:48 am
Lots of great comments.
I’m amazed that Mr. Williams’ can’t understand those who call him paternalistic. Adults still have the right in this country to make their own decisions AND their own mistakes as long as their conduct isn’t criminal. Williams exercised his right (at Indiana’s casinos) to find out for himself why not to gamble excessively. Allow others the freedom to do the same, and to go to hell if that’s what they choose to do. The state already has its nose way too far into matters that used to fall under the rubric of individual choice and personal responsibility.
The other side of his argument - that racing must rise or fall on its own merits - is logically consistent. Based on his record, however, he has no real interest in helping.
May 6th, 2010 at 10:02 am
Bobby (#10),
I am not sure what you mean by getting rid of the whales. Why would the tracks/ADW companies want to get rid of the whales?
May 6th, 2010 at 10:11 am
He sounds to me like he is not against slots,it just sounds like he is against the big corporations (Churchill) having them.Has anyone thought of proposing a bill with a casino run on more neutral ground?
May 6th, 2010 at 10:32 am
I fail to see where Williams offered a single solution. “Brand” KY racing? Huh? The tracks can get together and CD and KEE can make less money? Is that really a plan?
Perhaps if Williams were made Czar of all things he could put the genie back in the bottle and turn back the clock to a different time. But this is May of 2010 and slots are simply a part of the gambling landscape. The only thing that will stem the negative tide for racing and breeding in KY outside of opening KY’s borders up to alternate sources of gambling would be for the state to slash the amount of taxes it receives from handle and split it between the horsemen and the gamblers in the form of lower takeout. Perhaps then the purse levels coud be sustained enough to keep some of the horse population intact, further fund the breed incentive program and make KY’s signal the most attractive in the country. While the state would suffer a shortage of revenue in the sort term, a thriving industry would create more taxable business in the long run, especially if Blackjacks prophecy of alt gambling killing racing in other states comes true.
But we all know there is zero chance of that ever happening.
May 6th, 2010 at 11:04 am
If the horse racing business model requires susbsidies from slots then there is something wrong with the business model.
Any corporation that has a weak subsidiary will sell it off rather than have it bleed off money from the more efficient and successful enterprises.
Part of racing problems have been well stated by previous posters, but one factor definitely is that some racing managers apparently do not have a feel for the horse and the sport around it. I. E. the NYRA higher echelon.
It is also tough to maintain intergrity and honesty in a sport based on gambling and quick money, but intergrity and honesty have to be held to as a standard.
Goldman Sachs is being pilloried justifiably for screwing its customers instead of putting their interests first for long term relationship and sustainable profit. Take heed
May 6th, 2010 at 11:06 am
Wesly,
Well said.
May 6th, 2010 at 11:12 am
he was probably only there at the meeting because a certain gentleman who builds homes told him to be.He is a politician,so dont believe too much.
May 6th, 2010 at 11:36 am
David Williams wants to be Kentucky’s next Governor. The thought of running without any support from the states signature industry or worse yet have a mobilized, unified (for the first time ever) horse industry opposing him, is a bit daunting. David Williams, with the prompting of right wing activists, has stood directly in the path of putting our thoroughbred industry on equal footing with the racing states that surround us. He now has no choice but to try and appease this large and angry group which represents some 40,000 direct and at least that many more indirect jobs to this state. Senator Williams is not only worried about his own run for Governor but also the political future of the lambs that followed him. Senator Alice Kerr, the senator from Lexington who voted against the industry’s expanded gaming bill, is facing stiff oppostion from a Republican, Veterinarian named Andy Roberts. A Roberts’ victory would send a very strong message to Frankfort that David Williams is not the one to follow. Williams has made a mess of this issue from the very beginning and now has a “new found” interest in helping us. We are not that dumb.
May 6th, 2010 at 12:51 pm
#19, are you Ray Paulick? Please clarify
May 6th, 2010 at 1:44 pm
Okay Dave, I agree with all you said about the slot masters that run Churchill and Penn National. It IS all about getting rid of horses and becoming the seedy imitations of the Vegas strip. All one has to do is visit Penn National and marvel at how marginalized racing has become. It is so clear, at least to me, that the slots industry is not trying to become a “Sport of Kings” or even a good imitation of Vegas, but aspires to nothing more than a two bit circus aimed at the bottom 1/3rd of a state’s median income. So you have my agreement about slots, but not on some supposed high moral ground, but because of the painful truths that you mentioned about the mucky mucks that run the “racetrack industry”.
You don’t treat the horse industry like Toyota, despite the fact, that at the very least, we employ three times the number of people in our industry then those that slap hubcaps on Camry’s in Georgetown. If Toyota wanted another round of state tax subsidies, you’d line up with big signs on your back so you could tell everyone what big job creators you are. And yes, just like everyone else in agriculture, the industry employs lots of illegal immigrants. Republicans could really help all of agriculture by not playing to the Nazi elements in your party and actually address meaningful immigration reform. But your party doesn’t have that kind of courage, and the broken system that everyone hates will lurch along maintaining it’s lies and deceits.
So Dave, I’ll tell you what, come on over to our farm. We’re just a small farm but we are people who have moved to the Bluegrass because we wanted to, not because we were born here. I’ll invite a few of my friends and we can talk about what would really benefit our industry. Barry you should come too. We won’t call each other names or even talk about politics in the divided and unfortunate sense of the word. I don’t care anymore about “party” affiliation and neither should you. Isn’t it enough that we are Kentuckians, or on the macro scale, Americans?
May 6th, 2010 at 1:53 pm
Regarding the question of whether comment #19 comes from me, no, it does not. Any comments from me will include my full name.
May 6th, 2010 at 2:11 pm
I doubt Williams wants to eliminate whales; just their subsidy at the expense of horsemen and other players. It’s the right message, but the wrong messenger for all the reasons mentioned previously. Perhaps the Paulick Report could do a similar interview with New York Assembly Speaker Silver about how NYRA could continue to operate without slots.
Overall takeout needs to be lower and effectively equal for all participants in any parimutuel pool. Signal pricing that favors off-track bet-takers over host tracks, and enables rebating of individual players, should be eliminated. A more collective approach is required.
One way to balance the needs of players, horseman, track operators, and government might be to adjust both the size of the pie and the portion each receives dynamically by individual pool as predetermined levels of handle are reached. The trick is to focus on the net increase to all as handle increases with the popularity of the product.
May 6th, 2010 at 3:07 pm
no Indulto–one way to balance needs is to quit bringing up “take out” every time a horse issue is discussed. another way, might be to “increase revenue”. my take–whales are completely unnecessary to our sport, and listening to their wants and desires distracts from “real” issues that face the sport e.g. unnecessary hub bub about past post betting. gambling is a churn process. today’s whales will be tomorrow’s stock porkers or whatever their new endeavor. congrats to Paulick for including Mr. Williams views. He comes across well! Possibly less the evil villain than supposed.
May 6th, 2010 at 4:11 pm
Ray Paulick worked for Barry Obama’s election. I’d rather be called Blackjack any old day in comparison.
May 6th, 2010 at 4:56 pm
Ratherrapid,
You must have either read my remarks too rapidly or else were wearing blinkers. I’m not interested in saving whales who I believe do more to hurt the overwhelming majority of recreational bettors than any other faction in racing. Takeout is not only relevant to any discussion of whales, it is germane to any conversation about the future of racing. Far from being a distraction, it is a very real issue because exorbitant takeout rates — from which only a select few currently get relief — is preventing growth and thus prosperity.
Don’t assume that everybody advocating lower takeout is a whale or a professional player. Even those of us who bet regularly for entertainment know that lower takeout would keep us playing the game longer and putting more money into the pools.
May 6th, 2010 at 5:27 pm
Most of you wouldn’t know a whale from a minnow or a slot mahine from a washing machine and therein lies the problem. The dozen or so people who are the same ones on virtually every racing/breeding/sales committeee, board or task force don’t either. It’s always the same old, same old names. Most have trouble running the farms they bought with inherited money let alone run the racing or breeding industry.
Let me fix it all for you. Hire Terry Lanni, former CEO of MGM Mirage in Las Vegas. He was the best pure operator in the gaming industry (since the mob) before he retired a few years ago. Give him the reins, leave him alone and let him get the mess straightened out.
Stop the stupid racetrack giveaways as a substitute for marketing. Stop the incessant banter about attracting “young” people. They don’t have any money. Go after the 40-70 demographic, the most reachable and most well off in history. Why do you think major (smart) companies go after that age group with spokespeople like Racquel Welch.
OK, that’s it. Lesson over. Now go ahead and pack the tracks with slots and then wonder why they are not a panacea.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:29 pm
In a nutshell, the real problem is that those jerks that represented horsemen when the contracts were written in the 1970s with racetracks for the signals sold us owners and breeders right down the toilet. Until the model is restructured, nothing good is going to happend to us. For change to take place, horsemen would need to unite, show some testicular fortitude and withhold our horses from races until the tracks came to the bargaining table in the proper frame of mind. But horsemen, particularly in the cozy atmosphere of the bluegrass, don’t want to offend the powers that be at the racetrack. So the game is likely to slide into oblivion at the rate things are degenerating. We don’t need slots, we just need our fair share of the frigging pie.
May 6th, 2010 at 8:49 pm
Is it dawning on a growing number that slot machines are not the cure for what ails us?
In both his posts, Barry Irwin has hit the mark.
May 6th, 2010 at 10:16 pm
We have tracks that aren’t staying open year round since it is not economically feasible. That wouldn’t happen 10-15 years ago.
May 7th, 2010 at 4:05 am
David Williams’ skin is so thin that it’s surprising he waited this long to attack you for the appropriate name you have given him.
He is also a huge liar. Check out the stories of his taking KSP officers to Mississippi casinos while he was on “official state business.” Those guys can confirm a lot.
May 7th, 2010 at 7:35 am
williams>>>>a true republican….went to school…never had a real job..maybe a draft dodger. a know it all. read some books, maybe wrote a few…became a political bear…”THATS ALL FOLKS”.!!!!!!
May 7th, 2010 at 10:14 am
Not a big fan of Williams, but have to agree with his points (and Barry Irwin’s). Slot machines are not horse racing, and once they are allowed it WILL be the end of our industry.
The problem, as i see it, is the same arrogant groups control every aspect of our industry (and have for many years). Whilst it is being flushed down the tubes, it does not affect them in the same devastating way it does those on the backside, or the farms. If they lived paycheck to paycheck they might change their stance pretty rapidly.
May 7th, 2010 at 11:21 am
Barry, you are certainly not retarded… quite to the contrary, you have a great mind. You are right that we need our share of the friggin pie. But this Williams blow above is just more rhetoric. Its just his typical blather that really never makes a lot of sense.. “We want to get all the racing states to get together and increase the level of cooperation”. This has been a huge and age old problem in racing for years and of course a unification of the racing states would be a huge step. But he refers to “we”; who is “we” and where has “we” been the many years he has been in office. He thinks it can be done in 2 to 3 years; improbable and from a practical standpoint, impossible. And thank God he is all behind the savior New York taking the lead on this issue. NewYork racing hasn’t been able to get out of its own way for 30 years and now is fighting for its own life due to New York’s government and its gross incompetency, among other NYRA problems. I have been reading Williams rhetoric for over a year now. Much of it is inarticulate and unreadable. It is a polotical ruse t to show his support for thoroughbred racing in Kentucky, which is insincere and a smoke screen for his true ego-driven agenda. Our big mistake was that we didn’t communicate with him and stroke that large ego many years ago before all this started. We should all be so proud of our politicians. BTW… Lexington-Fayette Counties own Alice Forgy Kerr may be the most disengenuous in Ky. Don’t forget the election coming up for this duplicitous candidate.
May 7th, 2010 at 1:23 pm
Williams is Kentucky’s version of George Rekers. Saying one thing and doing QUITE another
May 7th, 2010 at 2:16 pm
He’s got Churchill Downer pegged…
May 7th, 2010 at 11:08 pm
The only thing that keeps racing alive in Kentucky is David Williams. The owners of these race tracks have business models that can’t stand on racing alone. Churchill Downs wants customers to stay home and use TS to make their wagers. They can cut their work force to nothing and their profits will double. They want Oak’s and Derby Day as the only live racing day’s for customers. I believe their goal is for two live racing day’s then casino gambling, that’s what I think. They started running horse players off when they built them a $140,000,000 casino.
New York loses $30,000,000 every year for last 20 years and the tax payers money is given to them so they can keep a losing business up and running for a handful of thieves. Casino’s will kill racing all the way dead. Barry anyone that would vote for any liberal is mentally challenged. You can’t give me the name of any democrat that’s not a Socialist Liberal Communist.
Buddy
May 10th, 2010 at 3:34 pm
Great post! I really love your nice blog! I also commented at your other post that I thought was awesome.
May 11th, 2010 at 1:19 pm
As a whole, these responses leave me wondering if you guys have any clue what you are talking about and what the problems are and why
Amazing that most of you can get out of bed in the morning